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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:48 pm 
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I think this thread is relying on too many aspects that simply aren't happening and never have. Talking of people bidding 20x a player's value, bids being over the limit etc just haven;t happened. No one is going to those extremes.

Will they on the new game, maybe, maybe not. Either way, saying it is happening in SS1 is just trying to create "proof" of a need for change where it doesn't exist.

I have had managers say they exceeded the limit in the past and unlike you I checked into it and all that had happened is they had bid more than their bank balance allowed, they weren't anywhere near even 6 times the limit, never mind any more. Sorry, not buying that at all.

By all means call it an improvement (as that is clearly the belief) but let's not pretend there is anyone having bids blocked for going over the limit or anyone out there who ever intends to bid 20x the value in SS1.

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CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:49 pm 
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I do like your point that if somebody misses out by hitting the invisible wall, then somebody else benefits anyway. That's a good point. I suppose it means it's a difference between frustration over and invisible wall or frustration over what appears to be 'stolen' money.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:51 pm 
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But in that case, it won't matter since it's not happening anyway.

And one guy almost certainly did go over. From the information he gave me, he either bid over the limit or it was a bug (Edit - Cuz he did have the money in the bank).


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:56 pm 
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Assuming he was both honest and not just mistaken about getting the bid in and at the amount intended.

I say this because I can easily see at least one cheat in the game (you can probably guess who) who would contact you to make such a claim in the hope that you will say it shouldn't have happened to him and that you would create a copy of the player for him...

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:09 pm 
I'd ban managers from bidding for their own players on the auction market whether in the same league or a different one,then you could remove the limits and let rich managers bid as much as they like hopefully aiding poor/hopeless with money managers like me.
I doubt this would be popular as i know managers do bid for their own players and have seen a few happen lately,so still think what we have now is preferrable to what is being proposed.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:16 pm 
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Bans on your own teams is something that's been discussed before. Right now I can't add it into SS2 because I don't have any team-ownership right now, but I agree that it's an option. I might wait until testing and people can see if they like the idea of no limits whatsoever. We can easily shut down the cheating afterwards. The reason this doesn't always work is that in the past (we're talking the 90's here) people used to get turns sent to friends houses, and friends of friends houses etc, in order to slowly move assets around. It was really annoying and pretty much impossible to stop. In that case, the hard limits are necessary (although even then, they can't stop it). This is why a lot of games just don't allow you to have more than one team - but that doesn't work either because you can just fake accounts.

The bid in question was either a bug or hitting the limit, since he definitely had waaaayyy more money than his bid (he had about £50M and bid about £10M).


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:18 pm 
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The problem with banning managers from bidding on their own players at other sides is that if you bring in that rule then those managers are more likely to just keep those players between their own teams and not even list and give managers a chance to get them in the first place.

It's a lot harder to spot and prove a transfer deal is dodgy than it is to see an inflated bid by a manager owning both clubs. The latter is easy to see and always gets punished by Glynn. The former has to be spotted and proven and even then Glynn is wary of punishing unless circumstances really force his hand as it isn't something he enjoys (quite rightly as no one should enjoy that aspect).

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:32 pm 
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And as I just said, it's really impossible to stop cheating. Even if I did something like the SSO style, where everything is severely restricted and let's say we limited it to 1 team each (both very unpopular), it still won't stop people from making fake accounts from fake email addresses and transferring unfairly within the game limits (let's say all deals are limited to something very low, like 1.1x). You could still cheat, even with that.

So the system we have, whilst I don't like it, is the best we can do I think. It means less limits, which is good for the players and feels better for the game and more freedom and it is, theoretically, infallible (as in, theoretically, the managers could spot every cheat and it could be manually reversed / punished).


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:40 pm 
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Totally agree, my response was to Rob, explaining why it would be an issue, just happened you snuck in there again between posts :)

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:50 pm 
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Yeah. Plus another thing to point out here, is that it's a bit like that 'Should manager's be rewarded for extra effort?' question that I posed the other day. There's no actual answer to it in a multi-player game because some managers like putting in the effort and some don't. I don't see why either is the 'correct' way to play. And in this case (multiple teams), managers enjoy having lots of teams and there are cases where you can do mutually beneficial deals. Now some people would say that's unfair, and from some people's perspective (i.e those that have one team), maybe it can be seen that way. But it's a case of balance, the game has to be fun and it has to reward skill / effort. It's just a case of how far I want to take that.

Bear in mind that when the game came out, there was literally no testing and no balancing except for the run-throughs I did (and quite honestly, I was bored senseless by that time and wanted to get the game released). People just had to suffer from any poor decisions I made, and there were plenty, and we're still living with many of them :P

Another way of putting this is, you can't please all the people all the time. I just have to use my judgement and then we'll do some testing and then we'll see if it works.

I'm in half a mind to do a 'Half Life 3' here of course, not sure if anybody understands that reference though :P


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:59 pm 
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Oft rumoured but yet to appear...

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 9:16 pm 
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Worse (for us), they're not going to make it at all. Their reason being, no matter how good it is, they'll lose out. Sounds odd but having read their reasoning, I can see their point.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 9:24 pm 
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I think many people are refusing to accept it won't be made, denial can be fun :)

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:03 pm 
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I don't think they will now, or even license it out. It can only lose them money. Really strange phenomena.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:07 pm 
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Very strange indeed and like you say, not going to happen.

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(189T)
Image


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