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 Post subject: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:47 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:31 pm
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Pretty much the last 'feature' to go in. After that, just need to tidy some things up, add some AI (clearing unwanted players from unmanaged teams etc and perhaps selling them to the SLFA (in SS1, it just deletes them I think)) and then testing/balancing (there will obviously be loads of things I've missed too, but we can sort that in testing).

So, friendlies..... which of these things do you want?

Random? Do you WANT the friendly results to be totally random? Or at least have a 'random' result version?

Skill-based? By that, it'll be very simple, something along the lines of a 50% chance that the 'best' team will get an extra goal. Nothing more complicated than that. But is a skill-based version worth having?

Youth friendlies? Not sure if anyone would want it. If it was in, the skill would be as above.

Venue? Should the venue affect the result?

All of these could be tickable when selecting your friendly. Obviously it would have to match up the two sides to ensure both were identical and then play the friendly with the relevant instructions.

Any of these necessary/not necessary. Are you happy with just a straight random result as it is now?


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:03 am 
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Prefer random personally as it encourages managers to enter comps they wouldn't otherwise if their chances weren't equal to all others.

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Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
FENWAY VALIANTS (Comberton)....WPL14
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(138T)
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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:38 pm 
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Location: Derbyshire
Can we have a skilled friendly and a random friendly option?

What about 'extra time' type comps where you can select the team?

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Allestree Allstars nsa35
Dark Alliance nsa10
Duffield Dynamos opal39
Yorkshire Patriots rh7
Melwood moa4
St. John's United wpl40
Round Hill nsa41
Sa Domu Cheta ws14
SS2.0: Epping Utd (Champions of All)
SS2.1: Oxted Utd


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:46 pm 
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A selectable friendly would be a bit much now. It's possible but it's a lot of extra work and I'm not sure it's important enough to put another month into? It's an option for later if people really want it.

I could just have a tick-box for skilled/random then? So it'd be much like now, you select an opponent, a venue and a skill/random option?


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:17 pm 
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Will it be possible to do inter-league friendlies?

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Dave

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AFC Binfield WPL28
Astral FC RH44
Seabourne City WPL27
Poole Town Panthers NSA23
St Agnes Aces NSA13


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:04 pm 
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Posts: 494
Location: Long Eaton, Nottingham
Any thoughts on something like the Extra Time feature so we can have some more Inter League competitions.

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Mike

Long Eaton Archers WPL 7 Shaolin WPL 39
Istra Pula Opal 46 Abysmal Aftermath Opal 50
FC Abertawe Opal 1 Riverplate Opal 36
Dell Diamonds Opal 54 Norfolk FC Opal 37
Death Valley Wanderers Opal 35 Bayern FC Opal 45
Moles Rangers NSA30 Lakeland Jags NSA38
Celyn Coyotes WS 35 White Zombies WS4 FC Storm Chasers WS54
Lochar Thistle MOA 32

http://www.opal-league.webs.com


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:12 pm 
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Inter-league friendlies will now be standard. When you select an opponent, it won't matter which league they're from.

Since Mike is now the second person to mention the Extra Time style friendlies, then maybe it should be considered? It would require a selection process, just like the existing matches, which would mean a selection area. Basically, I'd probably put it alongside the first team/youth team selection and it would work the same. However, the matches couldn't be the same now since too much is already hard-coded.

Or would the simple style of friendlies be enough to run an inter-league tournament? Let's say you can choose any team, tick the 'Skill' box to get a result slightly in favour of the stronger team. Would that be enough, or would you want something much more in-depth, where you pick the players and their skills contribute to the result?


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:15 pm 
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I should say that I'd prefer the simple friendlies right now for obvious reasons. Having a simpler selection box might not be too bad along with a simpler SS1-style match (the SS2 matches are much more in-depth and take quite a while (in computing terms) to process). But if it's enough for your friendly tournaments, then would a simple friendly with a minor skill-based approach be enough? You just pick an opponent, tick a box to have it favour the stronger team and it generates a result? Or do you want more than that, such as selections shown on your sheets etc (in which case it would need to check for contracts/injuries etc).


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:37 pm 
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I think ultimately we are talking about two different types of friendly comps.

You have the general league ones where anything that has any weight based on skills etc will ruin them as the numbers that enter will drop as lesser sides will lose the chance they currently have to win.

Then you have the comps where managers want to prove who is best in terms of playing opponents/other leagues/other managers.

Personally feel there has to be the option for the first sort regardless or else the league comps will be destroyed as managers see the same best sides win them all the time.

Would be good to have the option of something with more control/more weighting to provide "realistic" results when trying to have a "who is best" style comp at any level but not at the expense of the former.

So basically, great if you can do both kinds but if it becomes a trade off then for myself I would say keep the level playing field. Hopefully however, you can do both types to some extent :)

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Cheers
Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
FENWAY VALIANTS (Comberton)....WPL14
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(138T)
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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:47 pm 
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They would probably have to be labelled differently then. It seems a bit odd really, you'd have 'Friendlies' (the simple sort) and then.... the other ... thing. I guess they could be labelled something along the lines of 'Competition Friendlies', meaning that they're used for competitive games only. It's not a huge deal, although it's going to take longer, but they'll need a proper selection area where you can at least see/choose players (again, it'll have to check contracts and injuries for this). The matches aren't huge, I can do a semi-complex match (basically just add together the ratings and come up with a result from that).

So I suppose I can at least get cracking on the simple friendlies which are completely random? The only option for them will be venue but you can choose from any league. That's fine for the basic friendlies?

Any thoughts of how to label the others? 'Friendly' might be a bad word. Perhaps something along the lines of 'Non-Official Matches'? Having said it like that, I kinda like it. I like the idea that you can run a match outside of the main matches so I'm inclined to think that I could make the result a bit more complex and ratings-based (though never including conditions due to leagues starting at different times and never with consequences, such as injuries).


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:34 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 8:39 pm
Posts: 165
Location: Dibden Purlieu, Southampton
Perhaps the Prem and Div 1 have their comp with Divs 2 and 3 their competition. Just a thought. I have no opinion either way so just throwing another option into the mix

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Dave
SHEPS SS ARMY

Inter Southampton (OPAL24) Yth Lge champs S9,S31,S32 SLFA cup winners S15
Wight Wanderers (OPAL5)
Southampton Sity (OPAL15) SLFA Cup winners S20 Joosters winner S24 Div 3 champs S25
Sylvan Lake (OPAL17) Div 1 champs S19,S29 SLFA cup winners S32
The Islanders (OPAL25)Yth Lge champs S25
Southern Vipers (OPAL48)
Yth Lge champs S24 Joosters winners S31


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:36 pm 
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I'm not going to do any more official comps now as it's already too hard-coded for more. These will all be player-run competitions only. You can basically do whatever you want with them. The question is, how involved the matches should be.


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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:51 pm 
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Yep, has to be said splitting comps into divisions wouldn't help the discrepancy in quality anyway as a manager taking on a culled team right now can still win a friendly comp, if ANYTHING is taken into account they won't be able to and would have no reason to enter, other than to throw away what little money they have.

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Cheers
Rich

CHARSCOT WANDERERS.........WPL1
DEP EL CELTICO.........................WPL37
WASCISCO RED SOX...................WPL43
ZIASTE NEQUENO.......................WPL24
CASTLE ROCK FURIES..................WPL31
FENWAY VALIANTS (Comberton)....WPL14
OSSUS STELLA SEI.....................ELZ56
REVELSTONE..(C 05/6, 08/9)........RH15....(138T)
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 Post subject: Re: Friendlies.
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:31 pm
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Here's a few thoughts I've had overnight about this. Take into account also that I'm trying to reduce manual input as much as possible and people have been getting quite extravagant with prize money lately, handing out 20 prizes etc, all of which have to be typed in. So, here's what I'm thinking....

All restrictions will be handled by you guys. If you want an under-24's tournament or a Div.3 tournament, it's up to you to handle that. It would be impossible to program in every eventuality and also restrictive. So any kind of tournament is possible. Both friendly styles mentioned below will be inter-league compatible.

Two types of friendly. One is the current style with just venue (I'll add 'neutral' + home and away) and your opponent. The result is completely random, except that the home team has a slight chance of scoring an extra goal (this already happens in SS1). The neutral venue will make it completely random.

A competitive friendly style (needs a name). You pick 11 players for this (no subs or tactics I think), who must be uninjured and in contract. The result will be a bit more complex, based around the formation and skills of the players.

Again, it's up to you to keep your eye on any rules that you impose. Obviously if you wanted an U21's tournament, you'll have to keep your eyes on the results to make sure nobody played anybody above 20.

Prize pools - I'm going to try to add something to automate this. Basically, anybody can open up a prize pool and give it a name (named after the tournament). The pool can be open, closed or invitation-only. You can do whatever you want with this prize pool, but it will be totally open for everybody to see. Every bit of money coming and going will be shown on turnsheets, to ensure no cheating. The maker will get to distribute the money however he wants, but again, this will be public. I'll try to add an HTML section where you can input some HTML, but there's a possible problem with injection which can cause hacking, so I'll have to check. If it's possible though, you may be able to do HTML tables etc and input them into the pool for everyone to see (though this is probably best just left to the forums).

Anyway, the point with this is, you can use it in conjunction with the friendlies to automate prize money. Teams pay the entry fee to join and you can see when that happens. The GM of the tournament sends out the money when it's complete.

Theoretically, you could use this to run something separate from the friendlies, such as the Prediction leagues you have etc. Though I think stuff like that would probably have to be run by me first because it could get a bit imbalanced. But I see no problem with people running some kind of pool based on something like the prediction leagues (which would be kept to the forums).

One thing I have to watch out for, if you have two potential friendlies each week and they're inter-league, you could end up seeing a possible 1000 friendlies each week which might be a bit mad on the turnsheets. I'm tempted to have a separate friendlies page which you load in on a separate webpage.


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